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@aionescu | |||||
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Windows 17035 Kernel ASLR/VA Isolation In Practice (like Linux KAISER). First screenshot shows how NtCreateFile is not mapped in the kernel region of the user CR3. Second screenshot shows how a 'shadow' kernel trap handler, is (has to be). pic.twitter.com/7PriLIJHe1
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Friel-1
@AaronFriel
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14 Nov 17 |
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Wasn't Kaiser shown to be ineffective and with a rather large cost to syscalls?
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Alex Ionescu
@aionescu
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14 Nov 17 |
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Source? :-)
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Friel-1
@AaronFriel
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14 Nov 17 |
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Did not find the lwn article on Kaiser's inefficacy that I read, but I did find this: lwn.net/Articles/73794…
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Alexander Riccio
@ariccio
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14 Nov 17 |
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Aaaand I got today's reading g set out for me
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@
@vpikhur
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14 Nov 17 |
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Surprise surprise :)
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Alex Ionescu
@aionescu
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14 Nov 17 |
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Well, I’m sure the perf costs (especially on modern hardware with PASID/PCID) will be weighed against the security benefits, and people that care about loopback perf can turn it off in the registry. Remember this is WIP so it may never ship.
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Friel-1
@AaronFriel
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14 Nov 17 |
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Reasonable. Can't imagine Microsoft will ship it if the perf hit on syscalls is ~40%.
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Alex Ionescu
@aionescu
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14 Nov 17 |
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I could easily measure it but MS gets mad if I ruin features ahead of time. I do quite like this one though and have nothing to bitch about :)
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Wikinger
@wikinger7
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14 Nov 17 |
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cant wait to the OS be 50% slower!!
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Dennis Martin Herbers
@D2KX_
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14 Nov 17 |
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KAISER is shipping in one of the next Chrome OS releases on existing Chromebooks.
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Friel-1
@AaronFriel
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14 Nov 17 |
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That's not the sort of workload I think Microsoft would be worried about. Browsers? Meh.
SQL Server? Would be very surprised to see Microsoft accept a perf hit there.
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Alex Ionescu
@aionescu
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14 Nov 17 |
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Fonts are now userspace and appcontainerized. Shit is getting real/hard/real hard.
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Friel-1
@AaronFriel
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14 Nov 17 |
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*joke about real mode vs protected mode*
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xpcmach2
@xpcmach2
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14 Nov 17 |
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I don't know but some security French dude said while back ago that CR3 is the most important register :)
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Ahiezer Alvares
@MrAlvares97
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14 Nov 17 |
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awesome!
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grsecurity
@grsecurity
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14 Nov 17 |
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PCID doesn't really help that much, and I don't think AMD has anything equivalent. twitter.com/grsecurity/sta… But yeah, the MS/Linux timing of the same magically appearing solution with no public involvement makes it painfully obvious there's something else influencing this choice
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Roi Perez
@roiontech
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15 Nov 17 |
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Nice find !
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Eliannuminas
@Eliannuminas
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15 Nov 17 |
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I thought ASLR has virtually no impact on performance?
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Alex Ionescu
@aionescu
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15 Nov 17 |
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We’re talking about dual page tables here :)
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